From rsnow1 at charter.net Fri Nov 1 13:38:30 2002 From: rsnow1 at charter.net (Richard Snow) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:38:30 -0600 Subject: [pups] this list Message-ID: <3DC1F736.4070607@charter.net> This was for older PDP's like the 11, wasn't it? I have a Vaxstation 3100. I do have the SIMH PHP simulator running which can simulate an 11, but I haven't done anything with it. Richard. From wkt at minnie.tuhs.org Fri Nov 1 13:55:57 2002 From: wkt at minnie.tuhs.org (Warren Toomey) Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 13:55:57 +1000 (EST) Subject: [pups] this list In-Reply-To: <3DC1F736.4070607@charter.net> from Richard Snow at "Oct 31, 2002 09:38:30 pm" Message-ID: <200211010355.gA13twq67691@minnie.tuhs.org> In article by Richard Snow: > This was for older PDP's like the 11, wasn't it? I have a Vaxstation > 3100. I do have the SIMH simulator running which can simulate an 11, > but I haven't done anything with it. > Richard. There's also the TUHS list which caters for non-PDP-11 UNIX platforms. http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs Cheers, Warren From mitch.wright at earthlink.net Fri Nov 8 13:33:54 2002 From: mitch.wright at earthlink.net (mitch wright) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 21:33:54 -0600 Subject: [pups] 2.9BSD and Simh Message-ID: <001401c286d7$aabdeee0$6401a8c0@5000P4> Hi Folks, Does anyone know how to build a full distribution tape in Simh format? Or am I over looking something simple? I can boot and run the root RL02 image but would like install the full system. Would like to do the same for the 4.3 and the VAX Simh. Thanks, Mitch -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wkt at minnie.tuhs.org Fri Nov 8 14:09:36 2002 From: wkt at minnie.tuhs.org (Warren Toomey) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 14:09:36 +1000 (EST) Subject: [pups] 1978 Tynix? (fwd) Message-ID: <200211080409.gA849aM52671@minnie.tuhs.org> ----- Forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- From: jorn at enteract.com (Jorn Barger) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 04:09:15 -0700 I'm not a PUPS subscriber, but I've been browsing the archives and I wonder if you know anything about this? In an old Byte (Jan 1981, p200) Sol Libes wrote: > "UNIX-Like Operating Systems Increasing In Popularity: > Several software suppliers are now offering UNIX-like > operating systems that may rival CP/M. The first > UNIX-like software package, called TYNIX, was released > for LSI-11 and Heath H-11 systems in 1978 by the > Boston Children's Museum..." My guess is that this was Heinz Lycklama's unreleasable LSI-Unix (LSX), and I've written him to enquire, but haven't heard back yet. [ you're probably right, but I'd assume that it was a binary-only release - Warren ] I'm working on a detailed timeline of Linux prehistory, so I'm also following your Xenix explorations. I'd really like to know who did the first x86 Xenix, HCR or MS? [ I thought it was HCR too, but I could be wrong - Warren ] ----- End of forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- From Bill.Mayhew at oracle.com Sat Nov 9 03:36:32 2002 From: Bill.Mayhew at oracle.com (Bill Mayhew) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 12:36:32 -0500 Subject: [pups] 1978 Tynix? (fwd) In-Reply-To: <200211080409.gA849aM52671@minnie.tuhs.org> Message-ID: Hello, No, TYNIX was not Heinz Lycklama's product... it was not related in any way, except that both happened to run on the same platform. In the time period in question, I was Director of the Center for Advanced Public Computing at the Children's Museum, and TYNIX was my creation. It was written to work on LSI-11 (aka PDP-11/03) systems (i.e. without memory management) to bring a few of the simplest components of the technology that distinguished UNIX from competitors like RSTS/E and RSX-11, to low-end (VERY low-end, by today's standards!) machines... specifically to handle some "real-time" (e.g., building security and HVAC control) and transactional applications, with a VT100 character-cell/"graphics" UI (hey, drawing a box on the screen was "graphics" in those days!), using a couple of "real" PDP-11s as... well... today they'd be called storage servers ;-) TYNIX contained no UNIX code; it ran in a disk-free environment, as a client in a serial (RS232, 9600bps) network, and was capable of running applications that were written in C, built, compiled, and tested on a UNIX system... as long as said applications were small enough ;-) It had drivers for the industrial/commercial analog and digital I/O components that were, at the time, typically sold as part of Digital's PDP-14 family... connected to the LSI-11 via the DRV-11 parallel interface card for the digital devices, and via another card, whose model number escapes me at the moment (AXV-11?), which handled analog I/O. Actually, I believe, at that time, the host system was running an enhanced (by me) version of Whitesmiths, Ltd.'s Idris operating system, not official UNIX, although it had run true UNIX in earlier years. I don't recall that TYNIX was ever circulated widely... there was no such thing as "marketing" it, and no demand emerged either. In 1981, I left the Museum, forming my own company, which ultimately did some work to port Idris to the VAX and the PDP-11 based Professional 3xx machines from Digital Equipment, along with adding some substantial (again, viewed in the context of the era) enhancements for performance and user-friendliness to the PDP-11 Idris product... which we re-sold as Idris-Plus, to nonprofit organizations running our applications software. TYNIX officially belonged to the Museum, and I doubt that it was circulated after my departure. TYNIX had potential... but then, so did Digital ;-) ... of course, TYNIX was developed as a non-profit activity, so it wasn't expected to make money... and didn't! I remember reading that article at the time, and being stunned to see my work mentioned in BYTE. (Then I learned that I was referenced in an edition of the Whole Earth Catalog, as well!) (The Children's Museum was the first licensee of UNIX outside the AT&T umbrella, in 1973. That was right around the cusp of the introduction of C ... in fact the first installation I did was UNIX with no C compiler available... followed within a matter of months by the first release of C. I had the pleasure of heavy involvement with USENIX and its predecessors in that era, and may or may not have submitted TYNIX code to them... along with some of my other work, such as a simple relational DBMS and some severely-improved disk and tty drivers). I also had the opportunity to spend time with Ken and Dennis... we went to Maynard together to test UNIX on a PDP-11/70, and watched it compile and build itself completely in memory (no on-disk temporary files), on that awesome 16-bit machine with 22-bit address space ;-) ... in something like 15 minutes. Today, I use an iPAQ which also runs completely in memory... but a lot more of it ;-) ) Tomorrow, after being away from Boston for 8 years, I'm flying back there, from Virginia, to pick up my new car... and, time permitting, plan to visit the Museum to see if any of my stuff is still running there :-) -Bill __________________________________________ Bill Mayhew The statements and opinions expressed here are my own and do not represent those of Oracle Corporation. -----Original Message----- From: pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org]On Behalf Of Warren Toomey Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 11:10 PM To: PDP-11 Unix Preservation Society Subject: [pups] 1978 Tynix? (fwd) ----- Forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- From: jorn at enteract.com (Jorn Barger) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 04:09:15 -0700 I'm not a PUPS subscriber, but I've been browsing the archives and I wonder if you know anything about this? In an old Byte (Jan 1981, p200) Sol Libes wrote: > "UNIX-Like Operating Systems Increasing In Popularity: > Several software suppliers are now offering UNIX-like > operating systems that may rival CP/M. The first > UNIX-like software package, called TYNIX, was released > for LSI-11 and Heath H-11 systems in 1978 by the > Boston Children's Museum..." My guess is that this was Heinz Lycklama's unreleasable LSI-Unix (LSX), and I've written him to enquire, but haven't heard back yet. [ you're probably right, but I'd assume that it was a binary-only release - Warren ] I'm working on a detailed timeline of Linux prehistory, so I'm also following your Xenix explorations. I'd really like to know who did the first x86 Xenix, HCR or MS? [ I thought it was HCR too, but I could be wrong - Warren ] ----- End of forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- _______________________________________________ PUPS mailing list PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups -----Original Message----- From: pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org]On Behalf Of Warren Toomey Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 11:10 PM To: PDP-11 Unix Preservation Society Subject: [pups] 1978 Tynix? (fwd) ----- Forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- From: jorn at enteract.com (Jorn Barger) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 04:09:15 -0700 I'm not a PUPS subscriber, but I've been browsing the archives and I wonder if you know anything about this? In an old Byte (Jan 1981, p200) Sol Libes wrote: > "UNIX-Like Operating Systems Increasing In Popularity: > Several software suppliers are now offering UNIX-like > operating systems that may rival CP/M. The first > UNIX-like software package, called TYNIX, was released > for LSI-11 and Heath H-11 systems in 1978 by the > Boston Children's Museum..." My guess is that this was Heinz Lycklama's unreleasable LSI-Unix (LSX), and I've written him to enquire, but haven't heard back yet. [ you're probably right, but I'd assume that it was a binary-only release - Warren ] I'm working on a detailed timeline of Linux prehistory, so I'm also following your Xenix explorations. I'd really like to know who did the first x86 Xenix, HCR or MS? [ I thought it was HCR too, but I could be wrong - Warren ] ----- End of forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- _______________________________________________ PUPS mailing list PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups From MichaelDavidson at pacbell.net Fri Nov 8 13:39:49 2002 From: MichaelDavidson at pacbell.net (Michael Davidson) Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 19:39:49 -0800 Subject: [pups] 1978 Tynix? (fwd) References: <200211080409.gA849aM52671@minnie.tuhs.org> Message-ID: <3DCB3205.A5C8A531@pacbell.net> Warren Toomey wrote: > > ----- Forwarded message from Jorn Barger ----- > > From: jorn at enteract.com (Jorn Barger) > Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 04:09:15 -0700 > [ ... ] > > I'm working on a detailed timeline of Linux prehistory, so I'm also > following your Xenix explorations. I'd really like to know who did the > first x86 Xenix, HCR or MS? > > [ I thought it was HCR too, but I could be wrong - Warren ] > I'm almost certain it was MS who did the first x86 version of XENIX. HCR did do some work with PDP-11 XENIX - notably Mike Tilson's RT-11 emulator, and I know there was some tie-in with Microsoft in the early days but I'm not sure exactly what it was. If HCR had been involved in the early XENIX x86 work I find it incredible that nobody (including Tilson) ever mentioned it to me when we (I was with SCO at the time) bought HCR back in the early 90's. If I can find Tilson I'll ask him if he remembers any of this. From wkt at minnie.tuhs.org Sat Nov 9 13:17:41 2002 From: wkt at minnie.tuhs.org (Warren Toomey) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 13:17:41 +1000 (EST) Subject: [pups] Re: Children's Museum In-Reply-To: from Bill Mayhew at "Nov 8, 2002 12:36:32 pm" Message-ID: <200211090317.gA93Hfh66932@minnie.tuhs.org> In article by Bill Mayhew: > (The Children's Museum was the first licensee of UNIX outside the AT&T > umbrella, in 1973. That was right around the cusp of the introduction of C > ... in fact the first installation I did was UNIX with no C compiler > available... followed within a matter of months by the first release of C. Bill, is there any chance that the Museum might have anything (anything?!) from before 6th Edition UNIX? Warren From helbig at informatik.ba-stuttgart.de Sat Nov 9 20:45:33 2002 From: helbig at informatik.ba-stuttgart.de (helbig at informatik.ba-stuttgart.de) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:45:33 +0100 Subject: [pups] 2.9BSD and Simh Message-ID: <2967e324d73a0035932c426ee6cd89d5@informatik.ba-stuttgart.de> Hi Mitch, you'll find the program enblock.c at http://www.ba-stuttgart.de/~helbig/os/v6/ that I wrote to prepare the v6 distribution tape for SIMH. With v7, you need to apply different block sizes like (f0, f1, ... f6 from Keith Bostic): enblock dist.tap enblock >dist.tap ... enblock >dist.tap enblock 10240 >dist.tap enblock 10240 >dist.tap enblock >dist.tap Enblock puts an EOF tapemark at the end. The last invocation puts an EOT mark. Have fun, Wolfgang -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: unknown sender Subject: no subject Date: no date Size: 38 URL: From mitch.wright at earthlink.net Fri Nov 8 13:33:54 2002 From: mitch.wright at earthlink.net (mitch wright) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 21:33:54 -0600 Subject: [pups] 2.9BSD and Simh Message-ID: <001401c286d7$aabdeee0$6401a8c0@5000P4> Hi Folks, Does anyone know how to build a full distribution tape in Simh format? Or am I over looking something simple? I can boot and run the root RL02 image but would like install the full system. Would like to do the same for the 4.3 and the VAX Simh. Thanks, Mitch -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Mario.Premke at epost.de Sat Nov 16 07:08:16 2002 From: Mario.Premke at epost.de (Mario Premke) Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 22:08:16 +0100 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 Message-ID: <3DD561FF00000045@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Hello, I just read the instructions of how to boot a binary version 7 disk image on a ersatz11 pdp11 emulator. The links pointing to the 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' image I found are dead ... :-( Are there any other sites where I can download this binary distribution ?? BTW their are disk dumps of version 7 in the Caldera ancient unix archive . is it possible to boot them on ersatz11 as well ? I tried it a few times without success ... I simply tried it with the following e11.ini (from a newsgroup discussion), because I heavily lack PDP 11 hardware knowledge. Nevertheless trying this ini-file and many variations I made of it all end up in a blank emulator screen ... Any ideas will be appreciated Mario Premke (Please, send a return mail to my E-Mail address, since I am not on the list ..) ; Set up some terminal devices assign tt0: f1 assign tt1: f2 set scroll hard ; Make the CPU like an 11/45 set cpu dspace set cpu dualregset set cpu mmtraps set cpu pirq set cpu spl set cpu supmode set cpu cpuerr set cpu csm set cpu tstset ; Get rid of unneeded device delays set delay dl11 0=0 1=0 set delay rl11 0=0 1=0 2=0 3=0 4=0 5=0 6=0 7=0 ; Mount the RL02 disk image mount dl0: v7_rl.dsk ; and boot boot dl0: From Mario.Premke at epost.de Sat Nov 16 23:25:22 2002 From: Mario.Premke at epost.de (Mario Premke) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 14:25:22 +0100 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 Message-ID: <3DD6419800000E18@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Hello, I just read the instructions of how to boot a binary version 7 disk image on a ersatz11 pdp11 emulator. The links pointing to the 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' image I found are dead ... :-( Are there any other sites where I can download this binary distribution ?? BTW their are disk dumps of version 7 in the Caldera ancient unix archive .. is it possible to boot them on ersatz11 as well ? I tried it a few times without success ... I simply tried it with the following e11.ini (from a newsgroup discussion), because I heavily lack PDP 11 hardware knowledge. Nevertheless trying this ini-file and many variations I made of it all end up in a blank emulator screen ... Any ideas will be appreciated Mario Premke ; Set up some terminal devices assign tt0: f1 assign tt1: f2 set scroll hard ; Make the CPU like an 11/45 set cpu dspace set cpu dualregset set cpu mmtraps set cpu pirq set cpu spl set cpu supmode set cpu cpuerr set cpu csm set cpu tstset ; Get rid of unneeded device delays set delay dl11 0=0 1=0 set delay rl11 0=0 1=0 2=0 3=0 4=0 5=0 6=0 7=0 ; Mount the RL02 disk image mount dl0: v7_rl.dsk ; and boot boot dl0: From hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net Sat Nov 16 23:50:52 2002 From: hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net (Gregg C Levine) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 08:50:52 -0500 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 In-Reply-To: <3DD6419800000E18@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Message-ID: <000001c28d77$2e3a6a00$5074580c@who> Hello from Gregg C Levine How do you mean by that? " The links pointing to the 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' image I found are dead ... :-(" You said. How so? As I recall, that file that's in there, for unix_v7_rl.dsk" is there, it's a totally different UNIX_v7 file name, you need to call it that for the E11 product. For SIMH, the full name as rendered by the extraction process from the compressed file works. ------------------- Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net ------------------------------------------------------------ "The Force will be with you...Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi "Use the Force, Luke."  Obi-Wan Kenobi (This company dedicates this E-Mail to General Obi-Wan Kenobi ) (This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda ) > -----Original Message----- > From: pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org] On > Behalf Of Mario Premke > Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 8:25 AM > To: pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 > > Hello, > I just read the instructions of how to boot a binary version 7 disk image > on a ersatz11 pdp11 emulator. > The links pointing to the 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' image I found are dead ... :-( > Are there any other sites where I can download this binary distribution ?? > > BTW their are disk dumps of version 7 in the Caldera ancient unix archive > .. is it possible to boot > them on ersatz11 as well ? I tried it a few times without success ... > I simply tried it with the following e11.ini (from a newsgroup discussion), > because I heavily lack > PDP 11 hardware knowledge. Nevertheless trying this ini-file and many > variations I made of it all > end up in a blank emulator screen ... > > Any ideas will be appreciated > > Mario Premke > > ; Set up some terminal devices > assign tt0: f1 > assign tt1: f2 > set scroll hard > ; Make the CPU like an 11/45 > set cpu dspace > set cpu dualregset > set cpu mmtraps > set cpu pirq > set cpu spl > set cpu supmode > set cpu cpuerr > set cpu csm > set cpu tstset > ; Get rid of unneeded device delays > set delay dl11 0=0 1=0 > set delay rl11 0=0 1=0 2=0 3=0 4=0 5=0 6=0 7=0 > ; Mount the RL02 disk image > mount dl0: v7_rl.dsk > ; and boot > boot dl0: > > > _______________________________________________ > PUPS mailing list > PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org > http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups From Mario.Premke at epost.de Sun Nov 17 08:23:30 2002 From: Mario.Premke at epost.de (Mario Premke) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 23:23:30 +0100 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 Message-ID: <3DD6C28D000003D6@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Hello Gregg, thanks for your immediate response ! I recently found the article 'Booting 7th Edition UNIX Images' on the 'vmsnet.pdp-11'-Newsgroups: <--- SNIP ---> ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/sim/sources/ ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11-sims/Supnik_2.2d/sources/ Once you get it, you have to compile the simulator. You also need to fetch the 7th Edition UNIX disk images as well; they are available from the above ftp sites in the software directory (i.e replace sources with software. Unpack the 7th Edition tarball in the same directory as the one you built the simulator. The only file you require is disks/unix_v7_rl.dsk <--- SNIP ---> What I wanted to say is that the above ftp-links are dead. You are right, I should look for the compressed tarball, but I don't know how the tarball is called and looking for 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' on google only leads to other dead links ... Any hints ? Mario Premke ---------- > Von: Gregg C Levine > An: pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Betreff: RE: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 > Datum: Samstag, 16. November 2002 14:50 > > Hello from Gregg C Levine > How do you mean by that? " The links pointing to the 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' > image I found are dead ... :-(" You said. How so? As I recall, that file > that's in there, for unix_v7_rl.dsk" is there, it's a totally different > UNIX_v7 file name, you need to call it that for the E11 product. For > SIMH, the full name as rendered by the extraction process from the > compressed file works. > ------------------- > Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net > ------------------------------------------------------------ > "The Force will be with you...Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi > "Use the Force, Luke."  Obi-Wan Kenobi > (This company dedicates this E-Mail to General Obi-Wan Kenobi ) > (This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda ) > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org] > On > > Behalf Of Mario Premke > > Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 8:25 AM > > To: pups at minnie.tuhs.org > > Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 > > > > Hello, > > I just read the instructions of how to boot a binary version 7 disk > image > > on a ersatz11 pdp11 emulator. > > The links pointing to the 'unix_v7_rl.dsk' image I found are dead ... > :-( > > Are there any other sites where I can download this binary > distribution ?? > > > > BTW their are disk dumps of version 7 in the Caldera ancient unix > archive > > .. is it possible to boot > > them on ersatz11 as well ? I tried it a few times without success ... > > I simply tried it with the following e11.ini (from a newsgroup > discussion), > > because I heavily lack > > PDP 11 hardware knowledge. Nevertheless trying this ini-file and many > > variations I made of it all > > end up in a blank emulator screen ... > > > > Any ideas will be appreciated > > > > Mario Premke > > > > ; Set up some terminal devices > > assign tt0: f1 > > assign tt1: f2 > > set scroll hard > > ; Make the CPU like an 11/45 > > set cpu dspace > > set cpu dualregset > > set cpu mmtraps > > set cpu pirq > > set cpu spl > > set cpu supmode > > set cpu cpuerr > > set cpu csm > > set cpu tstset > > ; Get rid of unneeded device > delays > > set delay dl11 0=0 1=0 > > set delay rl11 0=0 1=0 2=0 3=0 4=0 5=0 6=0 7=0 > > ; Mount the RL02 disk image > > mount dl0: v7_rl.dsk > > ; and boot > > boot dl0: > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PUPS mailing list > > PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org > > http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups > > _______________________________________________ > PUPS mailing list > PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org > http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups From bill at cs.scranton.edu Sun Nov 17 08:34:47 2002 From: bill at cs.scranton.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 17:34:47 -0500 (EST) Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 In-Reply-To: <3DD6C28D000003D6@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Message-ID: <20021116173322.Y24445-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu> On Sat, 16 Nov 2002, Mario Premke wrote: > Hello Gregg, thanks for your immediate response ! > I recently found the article 'Booting 7th Edition UNIX Images' on the > 'vmsnet.pdp-11'-Newsgroups: > > <--- SNIP ---> > > ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/sim/sources/ > ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11-sims/Supnik_2.2d/sources/ > Try http://simh.trailing-edge.com bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill at cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include From hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 17 09:31:35 2002 From: hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net (Gregg C Levine) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 18:31:35 -0500 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 In-Reply-To: <20021116173322.Y24445-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu> Message-ID: <000001c28dc8$4e741040$795a580c@who> Hello from Gregg C Levine No need to copy me on the address list, Bill. I caught Mario's message the first go round, and decided to ask what methods he used to follow this line of reasoning. It happens I sort of figured that he would have used google to find things. Google is famous for outdated links. ------------------- Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net ------------------------------------------------------------ "The Force will be with you...Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi "Use the Force, Luke."  Obi-Wan Kenobi (This company dedicates this E-Mail to General Obi-Wan Kenobi ) (This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda ) > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Gunshannon [mailto:bill at cs.scranton.edu] > Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 5:35 PM > To: Mario Premke > Cc: Gregg C Levine; pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Subject: Re: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 > > On Sat, 16 Nov 2002, Mario Premke wrote: > > > Hello Gregg, thanks for your immediate response ! > > I recently found the article 'Booting 7th Edition UNIX Images' on the > > 'vmsnet.pdp-11'-Newsgroups: > > > > <--- SNIP ---> > > > > ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/sim/sources/ > > ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11-sims/Supnik_2.2d/sources/ > > > > Try http://simh.trailing-edge.com > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > bill at cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include From Mario.Premke at epost.de Mon Nov 18 04:24:59 2002 From: Mario.Premke at epost.de (Mario Premke) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 19:24:59 +0100 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 Message-ID: <3DD7DE29000000A4@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Thanks a lot !!! That was what I was looking for ... Nevertheless, mounting the file and boot dl0: leads to the boot-prompt @ After typing unix the boot-prompt appears again - does the kernel have a different name ? Thanks in advance Mario Premke ---------- > Von: Bill Gunshannon > An: Mario Premke > Cc: Gregg C Levine ; pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Betreff: Re: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 > Datum: Samstag, 16. November 2002 23:34 > > On Sat, 16 Nov 2002, Mario Premke wrote: > > > Hello Gregg, thanks for your immediate response ! > > I recently found the article 'Booting 7th Edition UNIX Images' on the > > 'vmsnet.pdp-11'-Newsgroups: > > > > <--- SNIP ---> > > > > ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/sim/sources/ > > ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11-sims/Supnik_2.2d/sources/ > > > > Try http://simh.trailing-edge.com > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > bill at cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include From leypold at informatik.uni-tuebingen.de Mon Nov 18 06:09:58 2002 From: leypold at informatik.uni-tuebingen.de (M E Leypold @ labnet) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 21:09:58 +0100 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 In-Reply-To: <3DD7DE29000000A4@mail.epost.de> References: <3DD7DE29000000A4@mail.epost.de> Message-ID: <15831.63382.501553.698014@hod.void.org> Mario Premke writes: > Thanks a lot !!! > That was what I was looking for ... > Nevertheless, mounting the file and boot dl0: leads to the boot-prompt @ > After typing unix the boot-prompt appears again - does the kernel have a > different name ? > Thanks in advance > Mario Premke rlunix? Regards -- Markus From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Mon Nov 18 09:00:44 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Peter Turnbull) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 23:00:44 GMT Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 In-Reply-To: "M E Leypold @ labnet" "Re: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7" (Nov 17, 21:09) References: <3DD7DE29000000A4@mail.epost.de> <15831.63382.501553.698014@hod.void.org> Message-ID: <10211172300.ZM4321@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Nov 17, 21:09, M E Leypold wrote: > > Mario Premke writes: > > Nevertheless, mounting the file and boot dl0: leads to the boot-prompt @ > > After typing unix the boot-prompt appears again - does the kernel have a > > different name ? > > Thanks in advance > > Mario Premke > > rlunix? It should look something like this (from my 7th Editon on a real PDP-11): @boot boot : rl(0,0)unix The "@" is the bootstrap prompt, and the first "boot" is what you type. The second "boot" is from the boot program itself; the colon ":" is boot's prompt. "rl(0,0)" is what you type to name the device, unit, and partition, and "unix" is the kernel name. YMMV if you have a different kernel. BTW, to shut down an old system like this, you should (as root) type # kill -1 1 to stop user processes and return to single-user mode; then type "sync" a couple of times, to make sure any disk buffers are written out, and then stop the processor. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From frank at wortner.com Mon Nov 18 12:59:43 2002 From: frank at wortner.com (Frank Wortner) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 21:59:43 -0500 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 In-Reply-To: <3DD7DE29000000A4@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de> Message-ID: on 11/17/02 1:24 PM, Mario Premke at Mario.Premke at epost.de wrote: > Nevertheless, mounting the file and boot dl0: leads to the boot-prompt @ > After typing unix the boot-prompt appears again - does the kernel have a > different name ? boot dl0 @boot <- you type "boot" and press "enter" or "return" in reply New Boot, known device are hp ht rk rl rp tm vt : rl(0,0)rl2unix <- you type "rl(0,0)rl2unix" and press return mem = 177856 # <- you are now in "single user" mode <- press "control-d" to go to multiuser mode <- (the normal mode of operation) Restricted rights: Use, duplication, or disclosure is subject to restrictions stated in your contract with Western Electric Company, Inc. Thu Sept 22 06:26:09 EDT 1988 login: root <- login as "root" # <- Have fun ... <- You did make a backup of the disk image before you started, <- right? ;-) If you want to make things easier, your first command should be: # cp /rl2unix /unix Now you will be able to type "rl(0,0)unix" instead of "rl(0,0)rl2unix". Ps and other commands that need to read the system namelist also expect the kernel image to be named /unix. Enjoy! -- Frank "Plez cnoke if an rnsr is not reqid." Sign on Owl's Door, "Winnie the Pooh" From Mario.Premke at epost.de Fri Nov 22 06:39:06 2002 From: Mario.Premke at epost.de (Mario Premke) Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 21:39:06 +0100 Subject: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 Message-ID: <3DDD404E00000EE3@mail.epost.de> (added by postmaster@mail.epost.de) Thanks a lot - it works ... I am delighted !!! ---------- > Von: Frank Wortner > An: Mario Premke ; pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Betreff: Re: [pups] Looking for binary distribution of v7 > Datum: Montag, 18. November 2002 03:59 > > on 11/17/02 1:24 PM, Mario Premke at Mario.Premke at epost.de wrote: > > > Nevertheless, mounting the file and boot dl0: leads to the boot-prompt @ > > After typing unix the boot-prompt appears again - does the kernel have a > > different name ? > > boot dl0 > @boot <- you type "boot" and press "enter" or "return" in reply > New Boot, known device are hp ht rk rl rp tm vt > : rl(0,0)rl2unix <- you type "rl(0,0)rl2unix" and press return > mem = 177856 > # <- you are now in "single user" mode > <- press "control-d" to go to multiuser mode > <- (the normal mode of operation) > Restricted rights: Use, duplication, or disclosure > is subject to restrictions stated in your contract with > Western Electric Company, Inc. > Thu Sept 22 06:26:09 EDT 1988 > > login: root <- login as "root" > # <- Have fun ... > <- You did make a backup of the disk image before you started, > <- right? ;-) > > If you want to make things easier, your first command should be: > > # cp /rl2unix /unix > > Now you will be able to type "rl(0,0)unix" instead of "rl(0,0)rl2unix". Ps > and other commands that need to read the system namelist also expect the > kernel image to be named /unix. > > Enjoy! > > > > -- > Frank > > "Plez cnoke if an rnsr is not reqid." > Sign on Owl's Door, "Winnie the Pooh" > > > _______________________________________________ > PUPS mailing list > PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org > http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups From luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu Thu Nov 28 11:19:53 2002 From: luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu (Andru Luvisi) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 17:19:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh Message-ID: I have gotten 2.11 installed on simh, I have it recognizing the simulated ethernet card, and everything appears correct except the packets just aren't getting in and out. The simh documentation says that the DELQA card is better than the DEQNA, but I was unable to get the DELQA (qt) driver to recognize the card. When I compiled the kernel to use the DEQNA (qe) driver and set the card up in DEQNA mode, the emulated card and its ethernet address were correctly detected. I have configured 2.11BSD with: A valid IP address on the network the host is on. The same netmask, broadcast, and gateway as the host. I am running the emulator as root. I have attached the DEQNA to the appropriate ethernet card. I can see the ethernet card go into promiscuous mode when I start the emulator. I have tested it with SANITY=ON and SANITY=OFF. The docs say you won't be able to talk between the host and the emulated machine, so my test for each configuration has been pinging the gateway, which I know responds to pings since I can ping it from the host. I have been over both the 2.11BSD docs and the simh docs several times and as far as I can tell I am doing everything correctly. I would appreciate any hints that any of you can offer. Thanks, Andru Quote Of The Moment: Appel's method avoids making a large number of small trampoline bounces by occasionally jumping off the Empire State Building. -- Henry G. Baker, "Cheney on the M.T.A." From hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 28 12:19:58 2002 From: hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net (Gregg C Levine) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 21:19:58 -0500 Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000101c29684$ab563bc0$8d69580c@who> Hello from Gregg C Levine I've been trying to get that notion to work, since it was announced. Can you post an explanation, regarding how you constructed your 2.11 setup? Was it built from disk dumps, or from one of the previously built, and stored collections, on the Minnie, file server? Also, a posting of the startup script would be nice, along with what you are running this on. That way, we can possibly reproduce your problems for ourselves. Especially since this is one of my personal projects. And most importantly of all, what was the date on your simh download? ------------------- Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net ------------------------------------------------------------ "The Force will be with you...Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi "Use the Force, Luke."  Obi-Wan Kenobi (This company dedicates this E-Mail to General Obi-Wan Kenobi ) (This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda ) > -----Original Message----- > From: pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-admin at minnie.tuhs.org] On > Behalf Of Andru Luvisi > Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 8:20 PM > To: pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh > > I have gotten 2.11 installed on simh, I have it recognizing the simulated > ethernet card, and everything appears correct except the packets just > aren't getting in and out. The simh documentation says that the DELQA > card is better than the DEQNA, but I was unable to get the DELQA (qt) > driver to recognize the card. When I compiled the kernel to use the DEQNA > (qe) driver and set the card up in DEQNA mode, the emulated card and its > ethernet address were correctly detected. > > I have configured 2.11BSD with: > A valid IP address on the network the host is on. > The same netmask, broadcast, and gateway as the host. > > I am running the emulator as root. > > I have attached the DEQNA to the appropriate ethernet card. I can see the > ethernet card go into promiscuous mode when I start the emulator. > > I have tested it with SANITY=ON and SANITY=OFF. > > The docs say you won't be able to talk between the host and the emulated > machine, so my test for each configuration has been pinging the gateway, > which I know responds to pings since I can ping it from the host. > > I have been over both the 2.11BSD docs and the simh docs several times and > as far as I can tell I am doing everything correctly. I would appreciate > any hints that any of you can offer. > > Thanks, > Andru > > Quote Of The Moment: > Appel's method avoids making a large number of small trampoline bounces > by occasionally jumping off the Empire State Building. > -- Henry G. Baker, "Cheney on the M.T.A." > > _______________________________________________ > PUPS mailing list > PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org > http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups From luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu Thu Nov 28 17:20:28 2002 From: luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu (Andru Luvisi) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 23:20:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh In-Reply-To: <000101c29684$ab563bc0$8d69580c@who> Message-ID: On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Gregg C Levine wrote: > Hello from Gregg C Levine > I've been trying to get that notion to work, since it was announced. > Can you post an explanation, regarding how you constructed your 2.11 > setup? Was it built from disk dumps, or from one of the previously > built, and stored collections, on the Minnie, file server? I used the files from PDP-11/Distributions/ucb/2.11BSD/ in the collection and built a tape image using a short perl script which I attached as "mktap.pl". I got the file format from the comments in the "mtdump" program from the "simtools.zip" archive (on simh.trailing-edge.com), and how to put the files onto the tape from the HOWTO file in the 2.11BSD directory. From there I pretty much just followed the HOWTO. The system is mostly functional. fsck still complains about a file that it creates. I stuck it all in one 128 meg file system, so I'm thinking of making another disk and file system just to stick the fsck temporary file on during boot. > Also, a > posting of the startup script would be nice, along with what you are > running this on. That way, we can possibly reproduce your problems for > ourselves. Especially since this is one of my personal projects. And > most importantly of all, what was the date on your simh download? I'm running it on a Linux 2.2 box. My ethernet card is a 3c905B in case it matters. I have attached my startup file as "simh". I am using simhv210-1.zip, which as I write this is still the latest one on the site. Any ideas to try? Hve you had any luck? Andru -- Andru Luvisi, Programmer/Analyst Quote Of The Moment: Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. -- Albert Einstein They laughed at Einstein. They laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown. -- Carl Sagan -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mktap.pl Type: application/x-perl Size: 1104 bytes Desc: URL: -------------- next part -------------- set tto 7b set dz lines=8 set dz 7b attach -am dz 4000 set ts enable set rq enable set RK disable set HK disable set TC disable set TM disable set xq type=deqna set xq mac=00-50-56-01-01-01 set xq sanity=on attach xq eth0 set cpu 3072k attach rq root.dsk boot rq From luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu Fri Nov 29 02:55:20 2002 From: luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu (Andru Luvisi) Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 08:55:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Andru Luvisi wrote: [snip] > From there I pretty much just followed the HOWTO. [snip] I forgot to mention: My other primary reference was PDP-11/Documentation/2.11bsd_setup.txt from the archive. Andru -- Andru Luvisi, Programmer/Analyst Quote Of The Moment: When some people discover the truth, they just can't understand why everybody isn't eager to hear it. From sms at 2BSD.COM Thu Nov 28 14:50:05 2002 From: sms at 2BSD.COM (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 20:50:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh Message-ID: <200211280450.gAS4o5824942@moe.2bsd.com> Hi - > From: Andru Luvisi > I have gotten 2.11 installed on simh, I have it recognizing the simulated > ethernet card, and everything appears correct except the packets just > aren't getting in and out. The simh documentation says that the DELQA > card is better than the DEQNA, but I was unable to get the DELQA (qt) > driver to recognize the card. When I compiled the kernel to use the DEQNA There are TWO variants of the DELQA as I recall. One was referred to as the "turbo" verion (I think it was called the DELQA-YM) and the if_qt driver was developed and tested specifically for, and only for, that variant. The normal DELQA and DEQNA should use the if_qe driver. > I have configured 2.11BSD with: > A valid IP address on the network the host is on. > The same netmask, broadcast, and gateway as the host. > I am running the emulator as root. > > The docs say you won't be able to talk between the host and the emulated Hmmm, that seems strange. Using P11 I talk between the host (the machine running the emulator program) and the "PDP11" all the time. Ah, it has to do with ARP handling I suspect. I know that with P11 it's IP only and thus ARP packets do not traverse the emulated ethernet card. If that is the case with simh as well then on the PDP11 side you might have to do what I did and install arp entries for everything on the local lan with which the PDP11 is going to communicate. That way the 11 already knows the 'mac' address and does not need ARP (which doesn't work thru the emulated ethernet) at all. > machine, so my test for each configuration has been pinging the gateway, > which I know responds to pings since I can ping it from the host. Ah, but on the host did you publish an ARP entry so that the host will arp for the PDP11? I think that is required. I would tinker around with installing published/proxy arp entries and seeing what happens. Cheers, Steven Schultz sms at 2bsd.com From luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu Fri Nov 29 11:22:09 2002 From: luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu (Andru Luvisi) Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 17:22:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD networking on simh In-Reply-To: <200211280450.gAS4o5824942@moe.2bsd.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Steven M. Schultz wrote: > Hi - > > > From: Andru Luvisi > > I have gotten 2.11 installed on simh, I have it recognizing the simulated > > ethernet card, and everything appears correct except the packets just > > aren't getting in and out. The simh documentation says that the DELQA > > card is better than the DEQNA, but I was unable to get the DELQA (qt) > > driver to recognize the card. When I compiled the kernel to use the DEQNA > > There are TWO variants of the DELQA as I recall. One was referred > to as the "turbo" verion (I think it was called the DELQA-YM) and > the if_qt driver was developed and tested specifically for, and only > for, that variant. The normal DELQA and DEQNA should use the if_qe > driver. The qe driver does appear to recognize the DELQA. Same results as with the DEQNA. It sees it, recognizes the ethernet address I configured it with, and the network configuration all seems to work, but once it's all up I can't get anywhere. > > I have configured 2.11BSD with: > > A valid IP address on the network the host is on. > > The same netmask, broadcast, and gateway as the host. > > > I am running the emulator as root. > > > > The docs say you won't be able to talk between the host and the emulated > > Hmmm, that seems strange. Using P11 I talk between the host (the > machine running the emulator program) and the "PDP11" all the time. > > Ah, it has to do with ARP handling I suspect. I know that with P11 > it's IP only and thus ARP packets do not traverse the emulated ethernet > card. If that is the case with simh as well then on the PDP11 side > you might have to do what I did and install arp entries for everything > on the local lan with which the PDP11 is going to communicate. That > way the 11 already knows the 'mac' address and does not need ARP (which > doesn't work thru the emulated ethernet) at all. I couldn't say. I just tried setting the arp information for the gateway in 2.11BSD, but to no avail. > > machine, so my test for each configuration has been pinging the gateway, > > which I know responds to pings since I can ping it from the host. > > Ah, but on the host did you publish an ARP entry so that the host > will arp for the PDP11? I think that is required. I just tried it, also to no avail. > I would tinker around with installing published/proxy arp entries and > seeing what happens. tcpdump isn't showing me any packets coming from or to the IP or ethernet address of the emulated PDP-11. Andru -- Andru Luvisi, Programmer/Analyst Quote Of The Moment: "Taking the envelope and pencil in his otherwise empty hands, the medium feels it, stares into space, grunts, foams at the mouth, and otherwise becomes very psychic." - Theodore Annemann From hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net Fri Nov 29 14:11:39 2002 From: hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net (Gregg C Levine) Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 23:11:39 -0500 Subject: [pups] Boot_Images and the networking activated version of Simh Message-ID: <001b01c2975d$79b12380$d167580c@who> Hello from Gregg C Levine Just out of curiosity, can the boot images stored in the folders that are under that name, actually support this new version of Simh? That is the PDP-11 emulator. What would be necessary to enable that function? It looks as if one of them, is aware of the device, since I believe the image was made on a machine which has the appropriate card installed in it, but after that I'm lost. ------------------- Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon at worldnet.att.net ------------------------------------------------------------ "The Force will be with you...Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi "Use the Force, Luke."  Obi-Wan Kenobi (This company dedicates this E-Mail to General Obi-Wan Kenobi ) (This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda ) From luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu Fri Nov 29 17:02:05 2002 From: luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu (Andru Luvisi) Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 23:02:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] Boot_Images and the networking activated version of Simh In-Reply-To: <001b01c2975d$79b12380$d167580c@who> Message-ID: On Thu, 28 Nov 2002, Gregg C Levine wrote: > Hello from Gregg C Levine > Just out of curiosity, can the boot images stored in the folders that > are under that name, actually support this new version of Simh? That is > the PDP-11 emulator. What would be necessary to enable that function? It > looks as if one of them, is aware of the device, since I believe the > image was made on a machine which has the appropriate card installed in > it, but after that I'm lost. I would be happy to share mine, but it doesn't work. ;-) The thing that strikes me as really weird is that I know a guy who is running VMS with networking on the simh VAX emulator. As I understand it, the the VAX and PDP-11 emulators use the same code for the ethernet controller. Andru -- Andru Luvisi, Programmer/Analyst Quote Of The Moment: Truth is hard to find and harder to obscure. From Fred.van.Kempen at microwalt.nl Fri Nov 29 23:47:09 2002 From: Fred.van.Kempen at microwalt.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 14:47:09 +0100 Subject: [pups] Boot_Images and the networking activated version of Simh Message-ID: <7AD18F04B62B7440BE22E190A3F7721407C6AE@mwsrv04.microwalt.nl> People, DO note that the Ethernet operations of SimH heavily depend on the proper workings AND configuration of a Packet Filter driver for your platform, so, something like BPF, EFILT, NetFLT or WinPCAP (for Win32). Try running a test app for that stuff BEFORE trying to run SimH/ENET stuff.. if the test app works OK, you can start figuring out why SimH/ENET doesn't work on your system. I have *three* network cards the drivers of which DO NOT support promisc mode. Which obviously results in WinPCAP (they're PCI cards under Win2K) not functioning properly, and, thus, same for SimH/ENET. --fred > -----Original Message----- > From: Andru Luvisi [mailto:luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu] > Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 8:02 AM > To: gregg at levine.name > Cc: pups at minnie.tuhs.org > Subject: Re: [pups] Boot_Images and the networking activated > version of > Simh > > > On Thu, 28 Nov 2002, Gregg C Levine wrote: > > Hello from Gregg C Levine > > Just out of curiosity, can the boot images stored in the > folders that > > are under that name, actually support this new version of > Simh? That is > > the PDP-11 emulator. What would be necessary to enable that > function? It > > looks as if one of them, is aware of the device, since I believe the > > image was made on a machine which has the appropriate card > installed in > > it, but after that I'm lost. > > I would be happy to share mine, but it doesn't work. ;-) > > The thing that strikes me as really weird is that I know a guy who is > running VMS with networking on the simh VAX emulator. As I > understand it, > the the VAX and PDP-11 emulators use the same code for the ethernet > controller. > > Andru > -- > Andru Luvisi, Programmer/Analyst > > Quote Of The Moment: > Truth is hard to find and harder to obscure. > > _______________________________________________ > PUPS mailing list > PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org > http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups > From luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu Sat Nov 30 03:22:38 2002 From: luvisi at andru.sonoma.edu (Andru Luvisi) Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:22:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [pups] Boot_Images and the networking activated version of Simh In-Reply-To: <7AD18F04B62B7440BE22E190A3F7721407C6AE@mwsrv04.microwalt.nl> Message-ID: On Fri, 29 Nov 2002, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > People, > > DO note that the Ethernet operations of SimH heavily depend on the proper > workings AND configuration of a Packet Filter driver for your platform, > so, something like BPF, EFILT, NetFLT or WinPCAP (for Win32). Try running > a test app for that stuff BEFORE trying to run SimH/ENET stuff.. if the > test app works OK, you can start figuring out why SimH/ENET doesn't work > on your system. [snip] A cursory glance at sim_ether.c makes it look like it uses libpcap, as does tcpdump. Does having tcpdump work count as a valid test? If not, can you suggest another program to try? Andru -- Andru Luvisi, Programmer/Analyst Quote Of The Moment: "In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe." -- Carl Sagan From mar.roba at videotron.ca Mon Nov 4 15:02:40 2002 From: mar.roba at videotron.ca (Marco Robado) Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 00:02:40 -0500 Subject: [TUHS] license Message-ID: <3DC5FF70.7070505@videotron.ca> Hi, I am curently writing an article about the history of open source. I know all you can find on the Internet about the history of unix and BSD and the conflict between these two when BSD decided to opensource. But I could never find a copy of both licenses in the early days. I would like to give examples of a license on which the source of a software was delivered in the 70's. I browsed thru the sources of unix v5 and the only copyright I found was in the code of the c compiler and it just stated that it was copyrighted by Bell labs in 1972. I would think that there was some kind of hard copy copyright that came with the tape on wich the sources were originaly delivered. For BSD I found in the source of 2.11BSD a reference to "The Berkeley software license Agreement" but I don't have a copy of that document. I would appreciate if someone would communicate with me by e-mail or thru this list to give me some info about all that. -M.R.- From grog at lemis.com Mon Nov 4 15:43:13 2002 From: grog at lemis.com (Greg 'groggy' Lehey) Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 16:13:13 +1030 Subject: [TUHS] license In-Reply-To: <3DC5FF70.7070505@videotron.ca> References: <3DC5FF70.7070505@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <20021104054313.GM54474@wantadilla.lemis.com> On Monday, 4 November 2002 at 0:02:40 -0500, Marco Robado wrote: > Hi, I am curently writing an article about the history of open source. I > know all you can find on the Internet about the history of unix and BSD > and the conflict between these two when BSD decided to opensource. But I > could never find a copy of both licenses in the early days. I would like > to give examples of a license on which the source of a software was > delivered in the 70's. I browsed thru the sources of unix v5 and the > only copyright I found was in the code of the c compiler and it just > stated that it was copyrighted by Bell labs in 1972. I would think that > there was some kind of hard copy copyright that came with the tape on > wich the sources were originaly delivered. For BSD I found in the > source of 2.11BSD a reference to "The Berkeley software license > Agreement" but I don't have a copy of that document. I would appreciate > if someone would communicate with me by e-mail or thru this list to give > me some info about all that. I'll leave it to others to describe the early days. The Berkeley Software License Agreement, generally called the BSD license, is pretty straightforward, though. Take a look at http://www.freebsd.org/copyright/license.html for the original copyright, under which 4.4BSD was released, and at http://www.freebsd.org/copyright/freebsd-license.html for the current BSD license. Greg -- Finger grog at lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers From msokolov at ivan.Harhan.ORG Mon Nov 4 15:49:07 2002 From: msokolov at ivan.Harhan.ORG (Michael Sokolov) Date: Sun, 3 Nov 02 21:49:07 PST Subject: [TUHS] license Message-ID: <0211040549.AA08916@ivan.Harhan.ORG> Marco Robado wrote: > I would like > to give examples of a license on which the source of a software was > delivered in the 70's. I have the paper license for System V issued by AT&T to Case Western Reserve University, the famous UNIX source license. I have it buried somewhere in my papers. If you want it, I can dig it up and fax or snail-mail you a copy. (Sorry, no scanning. I use the computing technology from the days in question exclusively.) > For BSD I found in the > source of 2.11BSD a reference to "The Berkeley software license > Agreement" Yep, same for 4BSD. > but I don't have a copy of that document. I don't either. MS From msokolov at ivan.Harhan.ORG Mon Nov 4 16:05:23 2002 From: msokolov at ivan.Harhan.ORG (Michael Sokolov) Date: Sun, 3 Nov 02 22:05:23 PST Subject: [TUHS] license Message-ID: <0211040605.AA08946@ivan.Harhan.ORG> "Greg 'groggy' Lehey" wrote: > I'll leave it to others to describe the early days. The Berkeley > Software License Agreement, generally called the BSD license, is > pretty straightforward, though. Wrong. The Berkeley Software License Agreement and what is known today as the "BSD license" are two different things. The latter is the liberal header Berkeley started prepending around 1988 to files that were totally theirs without any Bell Labs code. The former was the paper license that went with the 4.3BSD and earlier tapes where Bell, Bell/Berkeley, and pure Berkeley parts were not distinguished and the entire system could be used only by holders of UNIX source licenses from AT&T. Although I've never seen it myself, the Berkeley Software License Agreement could not have been like the liberal header, it surely had stuff in it telling you that if you share it with anyone, you must first verify that the recipient has a UNIX source license from AT&T, etc. MS From jesperjacobsson at yahoo.se Sun Nov 10 08:18:07 2002 From: jesperjacobsson at yahoo.se (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jesper=20Jacobsson?=) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 23:18:07 +0100 (CET) Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? Message-ID: <20021109221807.73869.qmail@web21507.mail.yahoo.com> Hi there. I am a linux-user and I came across TUHS for the first time today actually when I was searching google for old unices. I love linux and am very interested in the history of unix. For some time I have wanted to try out some early versions of unix as I am in my early 20's and was born too late to have been around those days :( I havn't found any people to ask about this till today :) Anyway, I browsed the filearchive and I guess the distributions there surely won't work on my computer. Is there a way to get them work on a i386 computer? Have someone made any ports of an early unix system to i386 out of nostalgia? If not, could someone take it on as a hobbyproject so that new generations of unix-like-OS-users can explore it? It would be both fun and also very educational to play around with I am sure. I hope this email gets through and that I didn't annoy you guys. I have not signed up for this list I just emailed tuhs at minnie.tuhs.org directly and hoped it would get through :) Please send replies to jesperjacobsson at yahoo.se Answers would be very appriciated! Thanks in advance, Jesper ===== _____________________________________________________ Gratis e-mail resten av livet på www.yahoo.se/mail Busenkelt! From jss at subatomix.com Sun Nov 10 13:23:18 2002 From: jss at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 21:23:18 -0600 Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? In-Reply-To: <20021109221807.73869.qmail@web21507.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20021109221807.73869.qmail@web21507.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <125114051637.20021109212318@subatomix.com> On Saturday, November 9, 2002, Jesper Jacobsson wrote: > I guess the distributions there surely won't work on my computer. Got a PDP-11 or a VAX? > Is there a way to get them work on a i386 computer? Yeah. Get a PDP-11 emulator. Multiple ones exist, some freely available and some not. Use Google for instant gratification. -- Jeffrey Sharp From grog at lemis.com Sun Nov 10 13:16:07 2002 From: grog at lemis.com (Greg 'groggy' Lehey) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 13:46:07 +1030 Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? In-Reply-To: <20021109221807.73869.qmail@web21507.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20021109221807.73869.qmail@web21507.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20021110031607.GD93051@wantadilla.lemis.com> On Saturday, 9 November 2002 at 23:18:07 +0100, Jesper Jacobsson wrote: > Hi there. > > I am a linux-user and I came across TUHS for the first time today > actually when I was searching google for old unices. I love linux and > am very interested in the history of unix. For some time I have wanted > to try out some early versions of unix as I am in my early 20's and was > born too late to have been around those days :( I havn't found any > people to ask about this till today :) Anyway, I browsed the > filearchive and I guess the distributions there surely won't work on my > computer. Is there a way to get them work on a i386 computer? Have > someone made any ports of an early unix system to i386 out of > nostalgia? Well, I suppose it depends on what you mean by "early UNIX". FreeBSD, NetBSD and OpenBSD are all ports of BSD UNIX to at least the i386 architecture. > If not, could someone take it on as a hobbyproject so that new > generations of unix-like-OS-users can explore it? It would be both > fun and also very educational to play around with I am sure. Well, I suppose you could start with an early version of NetBSD or FreeBSD and use the machine-dependent parts to port older versions of UNIX. But it's a non-trivial task. Greg -- Finger grog at lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers From iking at windows.microsoft.com Mon Nov 11 15:39:17 2002 From: iking at windows.microsoft.com (Ian King) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 21:39:17 -0800 Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? Message-ID: I recall a thread about this only a few months ago. Check out the TUHS mail archive - I seem to recall that someone had ported V7 to the x86 architecture. Me, I have a PDP-11/34 in my basement.... -- Ian ________________________________ From: Jesper Jacobsson [mailto:jesperjacobsson at yahoo.se] Sent: Sat 11/9/2002 2:18 PM To: tuhs at minnie.tuhs.org Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? Hi there. I am a linux-user and I came across TUHS for the first time today actually when I was searching google for old unices. I love linux and am very interested in the history of unix. For some time I have wanted to try out some early versions of unix as I am in my early 20's and was born too late to have been around those days :( I havn't found any people to ask about this till today :) Anyway, I browsed the filearchive and I guess the distributions there surely won't work on my computer. Is there a way to get them work on a i386 computer? Have someone made any ports of an early unix system to i386 out of nostalgia? If not, could someone take it on as a hobbyproject so that new generations of unix-like-OS-users can explore it? It would be both fun and also very educational to play around with I am sure. I hope this email gets through and that I didn't annoy you guys. I have not signed up for this list I just emailed tuhs at minnie.tuhs.org directly and hoped it would get through :) Please send replies to jesperjacobsson at yahoo.se Answers would be very appriciated! Thanks in advance, Jesper ===== _____________________________________________________ Gratis e-mail resten av livet på www.yahoo.se/mail Busenkelt! _______________________________________________ TUHS mailing list TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs From szigi at ik.bme.hu Mon Nov 11 19:08:04 2002 From: szigi at ik.bme.hu (SZIGETI Szabolcs) Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:08:04 +0100 Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? References: Message-ID: <004001c28961$d7c266f0$26f34298@ik.bme.hu> > I recall a thread about this only a few months ago. Check out the TUHS mail archive - I seem to recall that someone had ported V7 to the x86 architecture. Me, I have a PDP-11/34 in my basement.... -- Ian Hi, I did a port of V6 to the 286. See: http://www.tuhs.org/Archive/Other/V6on286/ BTW, has anyone ran any Unix on the DEC Professional? (the desktop PDP11, and Vax-console)? Szabolcs From wkt at minnie.tuhs.org Tue Nov 12 08:59:07 2002 From: wkt at minnie.tuhs.org (Warren Toomey) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 08:59:07 +1000 (EST) Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? In-Reply-To: <004001c28961$d7c266f0$26f34298@ik.bme.hu> from SZIGETI Szabolcs at "Nov 11, 2002 10:08:04 am" Message-ID: <200211112259.gABMx7D06695@minnie.tuhs.org> In article by SZIGETI Szabolcs: > BTW, has anyone ran any Unix on the DEC Professional? (the desktop PDP11, > and Vax-console)? > Szabolcs Have a look in http://www.tuhs.org/Archive/PDP-11/Distributions/ucb/2.9-derivatives/ Warren From Bill.Mayhew at oracle.com Wed Nov 13 04:36:00 2002 From: Bill.Mayhew at oracle.com (Bill Mayhew) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 13:36:00 -0500 Subject: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? In-Reply-To: <004001c28961$d7c266f0$26f34298@ik.bme.hu> Message-ID: > BTW, has anyone ran any Unix on the DEC Professional? (the desktop PDP11, > and Vax-console)? Yes. I ported Idris (the independently-written system from Whitesmiths, Ltd.) to the Pro 350, in an earlier life, in the early-to-mid-1980s. -Bill __________________________________________ Bill Mayhew The statements and opinions expressed here are my own and do not represent those of Oracle Corporation. -----Original Message----- From: tuhs-admin at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:tuhs-admin at minnie.tuhs.org]On Behalf Of SZIGETI Szabolcs Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 4:08 AM To: tuhs at minnie.tuhs.org Subject: Re: [TUHS] port of old unices to i386? > I recall a thread about this only a few months ago. Check out the TUHS mail archive - I seem to recall that someone had ported V7 to the x86 architecture. Me, I have a PDP-11/34 in my basement.... -- Ian Hi, I did a port of V6 to the 286. See: http://www.tuhs.org/Archive/Other/V6on286/ BTW, has anyone ran any Unix on the DEC Professional? (the desktop PDP11, and Vax-console)? Szabolcs _______________________________________________ TUHS mailing list TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs