From wes.parish at paradise.net.nz Thu May 10 21:42:55 2007 From: wes.parish at paradise.net.nz (Wesley Parish) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 23:42:55 +1200 Subject: [pups] Two matters, two questions Message-ID: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and this time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and The Software Tools. Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a simulator/emulator? And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? And Spafford says, commenting on Prime's version of Software Tools, that the final release was into the public domain. Is it still extant? Has anyone seen hair or hide of the creature? That's the first matter/question. The second one is to do with /rdb, which a quick search on Google informs me, was written by Walter V. Hobbs of Rand Corp., and was placed in the public domain. It apparently is at: ftp://ftp.rand.org/pub/RDB-hobbs but I can't get through to it. Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date version of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to date myself ;) Thanks Wesley Parish -- Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish ----- Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla warfare means up to their monkey tricks. Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom of the foolish. ----- Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui? You ask, what is the most important thing? Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata. I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people. From dfevans at bbcr.uwaterloo.ca Thu May 10 22:49:02 2007 From: dfevans at bbcr.uwaterloo.ca (David Evans) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 08:49:02 -0400 Subject: [pups] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <20070510124902.GA26486@bcr10.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, May 10, 2007 at 11:42:55PM +1200, Wesley Parish wrote: > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a > hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the > Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) > Yes. There was a posting to, I think, alt.os.multics within the last few months describing it a bit. > Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a simulator/emulator? > And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? > I know that the above emulator was accessible on the net and was running Primos; I don't recall where it came from. -- David Evans dfevans at bbcr.uwaterloo.ca Research Associate http://bbcr.uwaterloo.ca/~dfevans/ Computer Laboratory, University of Cambridge From bill at cs.uofs.edu Thu May 10 23:13:13 2007 From: bill at cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 09:13:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [pups] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <2491.134.198.172.102.1178802793.squirrel@www.cs.scranton.edu> > I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and > this > time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and > The > Software Tools. > > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a > hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the > Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) Yes, take a look at the past couple of months in comp.sys.prime. There is an emulator running on, pf all things, a Sony Playstation 3. Apparently it is running a pretty complete version of Primos. telnet to prirun.dyndns.org (Note: I have not had the time to actually try it yet myslef but others seem to be having fun with it.) > > Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a > simulator/emulator? > And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? See the discussion mentioned above. There are, apparently, a lot of copies floating around. I used to have one but gave it to someone who still works extensively maintaining Primes as I figured he had more use of it. I also gave him my last Prime from my private computer collection. > > And Spafford says, commenting on Prime's version of Software Tools, that > the > final release was into the public domain. Is it still extant? Has anyone > seen hair or hide of the creature? If what youe mean is "The Software Tools Virtual Operating System" as opposed to the source from the Kernighan & Plauger book, I have been looking for over two years for any copy of it. I have even been in contact with Deborah K. Scherrer who was one of the originators of the project and a co-author of the paper from Communications of the ACM. No luck. It is like every copy has been lost even though there were thousands of copies for over 50 different systems. (not unlike my search for Tiny Pascal sources, which also seem to have been lost except for printed copies in the few remaining copies of The Byte Book of Pascal, but that's another story.) bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill at cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include From cowan at ccil.org Fri May 11 02:46:51 2007 From: cowan at ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 12:46:51 -0400 Subject: [pups] [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <20070510164651.GB19139@mercury.ccil.org> Wesley Parish scripsit: > Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? > (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date version > of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to date > myself ;) There is also a derivative of it which is open source, called NoSQL, using the same principles but in a lighter-weight way; it mostly uses awk and sed and other classical tools, rather than Perl. Unlike /rdb, NoSQL is being actively maintained. http://www.scriptaworks.com/cgi-bin/wiki.cgi/NoSQL -- John Cowan cowan at ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan I am he that buries his friends alive and drowns them and draws them alive again from the water. I came from the end of a bag, but no bag went over me. I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ringwinner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider. --Bilbo to Smaug From luvisi at gmail.com Fri May 11 03:12:02 2007 From: luvisi at gmail.com (Andru Luvisi) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 10:12:02 -0700 Subject: [pups] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <6a9b0cc30705101012u31554196s399b43a267f3d4ac@mail.gmail.com> On 5/10/07, Wesley Parish wrote: [snip] > That's the first matter/question. The second one is to do with /rdb, which a > quick search on Google informs me, was written by Walter V. Hobbs of Rand > Corp., and was placed in the public domain. It apparently is at: > ftp://ftp.rand.org/pub/RDB-hobbs > but I can't get through to it. > > Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? > (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date version > of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to date > myself ;) [snip] Hopefully one of the following will work for you: ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/unix/databases/flat-file/RDB/RDB-2.6d.tar.gz http://ftp.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/packages/distfiles/RDB-2.6d.tar.gz ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-stable/All/rdb-2.6d.tbz You may also be interested in NoSQL: http://www.scriptaworks.com/cgi-bin/wiki.cgi/NoSQL/HomePage and reldb: http://gatekeeper.dec.com/pub/usenet/comp.sources.unix/volume20/reldb/ Andru From aek at bitsavers.org Fri May 11 01:20:09 2007 From: aek at bitsavers.org (Al Kossow) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 08:20:09 -0700 Subject: [pups] [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <46433829.1080308@bitsavers.org> Wesley Parish wrote: > I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and this > time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and The > Software Tools. > > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? There is one running PRIMOS 19 Discussions in alt.sys.prime From aek at bitsavers.org Fri May 11 01:25:14 2007 From: aek at bitsavers.org (Al Kossow) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 08:25:14 -0700 Subject: [pups] [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <46433829.1080308@bitsavers.org> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> <46433829.1080308@bitsavers.org> Message-ID: <4643395A.3070601@bitsavers.org> Al Kossow wrote: > Wesley Parish wrote: >> I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and this >> time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and The >> Software Tools. >> >> Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? > > There is one running PRIMOS 19 > > Discussions in alt.sys.prime should be comp.sys.prime From wes.parish at paradise.net.nz Fri May 11 19:43:58 2007 From: wes.parish at paradise.net.nz (Wesley Parish) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 21:43:58 +1200 Subject: [pups] [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <200705112143.59176.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Thanks everybody for your replies. I've downloaded the rdb and NoSQL and will have a look at them. Now I'm off to look at comp.sys.prime and alt.os.multics! Again, thanks Wesley Parish On Thursday 10 May 2007 23:42, Wesley Parish wrote: > I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and > this time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos > and The Software Tools. > > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a > hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the > Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) > > Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a simulator/emulator? > And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? > > And Spafford says, commenting on Prime's version of Software Tools, that > the final release was into the public domain. Is it still extant? Has > anyone seen hair or hide of the creature? > > That's the first matter/question. The second one is to do with /rdb, which > a quick search on Google informs me, was written by Walter V. Hobbs of Rand > Corp., and was placed in the public domain. It apparently is at: > ftp://ftp.rand.org/pub/RDB-hobbs > but I can't get through to it. > > Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? > (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date > version of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to > date myself ;) > > Thanks > > Wesley Parish -- Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish ----- Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla warfare means up to their monkey tricks. Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom of the foolish. ----- Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui? You ask, what is the most important thing? Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata. I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people. From toresbe at ifi.uio.no Wed May 16 11:44:31 2007 From: toresbe at ifi.uio.no (Tore Sinding Bekkedal) Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 03:44:31 +0200 Subject: [pups] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <2491.134.198.172.102.1178802793.squirrel@www.cs.scranton.edu> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> <2491.134.198.172.102.1178802793.squirrel@www.cs.scranton.edu> Message-ID: <1179279871.7593.59.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2007-05-10 at 09:13 -0400, Bill Gunshannon wrote: > (Trimmed) > Yes, take a look at the past couple of months in comp.sys.prime. > There is an emulator running on, pf all things, a Sony Playstation 3. > Apparently it is running a pretty complete version of Primos. > telnet to prirun.dyndns.org That should be to port 8001, FWIW Rgds, -Tore :) From new_zmkm at hotmail.com Sun May 20 21:57:58 2007 From: new_zmkm at hotmail.com (zmkm zmkm) Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 11:57:58 +0000 Subject: [pups] sys III docs Message-ID: Hi all just a quick question , any documentation or notes available online for unix sys III ? Like the v7 ones . Tks & rgs _________________________________________________________________ Like the way Microsoft Office Outlook works? You�ll love Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_outlook_0507 From wes.parish at paradise.net.nz Thu May 10 21:42:55 2007 From: wes.parish at paradise.net.nz (Wesley Parish) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 23:42:55 +1200 Subject: [TUHS] Two matters, two questions Message-ID: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and this time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and The Software Tools. Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a simulator/emulator? And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? And Spafford says, commenting on Prime's version of Software Tools, that the final release was into the public domain. Is it still extant? Has anyone seen hair or hide of the creature? That's the first matter/question. The second one is to do with /rdb, which a quick search on Google informs me, was written by Walter V. Hobbs of Rand Corp., and was placed in the public domain. It apparently is at: ftp://ftp.rand.org/pub/RDB-hobbs but I can't get through to it. Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date version of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to date myself ;) Thanks Wesley Parish -- Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish ----- Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla warfare means up to their monkey tricks. Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom of the foolish. ----- Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui? You ask, what is the most important thing? Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata. I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people. From aek at bitsavers.org Fri May 11 01:20:09 2007 From: aek at bitsavers.org (Al Kossow) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 08:20:09 -0700 Subject: [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <46433829.1080308@bitsavers.org> Wesley Parish wrote: > I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and this > time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and The > Software Tools. > > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? There is one running PRIMOS 19 Discussions in alt.sys.prime From aek at bitsavers.org Fri May 11 01:25:14 2007 From: aek at bitsavers.org (Al Kossow) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 08:25:14 -0700 Subject: [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <46433829.1080308@bitsavers.org> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> <46433829.1080308@bitsavers.org> Message-ID: <4643395A.3070601@bitsavers.org> Al Kossow wrote: > Wesley Parish wrote: >> I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and this >> time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos and The >> Software Tools. >> >> Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? > > There is one running PRIMOS 19 > > Discussions in alt.sys.prime should be comp.sys.prime From cowan at ccil.org Fri May 11 02:46:51 2007 From: cowan at ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 12:46:51 -0400 Subject: [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <20070510164651.GB19139@mercury.ccil.org> Wesley Parish scripsit: > Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? > (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date version > of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to date > myself ;) There is also a derivative of it which is open source, called NoSQL, using the same principles but in a lighter-weight way; it mostly uses awk and sed and other classical tools, rather than Perl. Unlike /rdb, NoSQL is being actively maintained. http://www.scriptaworks.com/cgi-bin/wiki.cgi/NoSQL -- John Cowan cowan at ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan I am he that buries his friends alive and drowns them and draws them alive again from the water. I came from the end of a bag, but no bag went over me. I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ringwinner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider. --Bilbo to Smaug From luvisi at gmail.com Fri May 11 03:12:02 2007 From: luvisi at gmail.com (Andru Luvisi) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 10:12:02 -0700 Subject: [TUHS] [pups] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <6a9b0cc30705101012u31554196s399b43a267f3d4ac@mail.gmail.com> On 5/10/07, Wesley Parish wrote: [snip] > That's the first matter/question. The second one is to do with /rdb, which a > quick search on Google informs me, was written by Walter V. Hobbs of Rand > Corp., and was placed in the public domain. It apparently is at: > ftp://ftp.rand.org/pub/RDB-hobbs > but I can't get through to it. > > Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? > (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date version > of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to date > myself ;) [snip] Hopefully one of the following will work for you: ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/unix/databases/flat-file/RDB/RDB-2.6d.tar.gz http://ftp.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/packages/distfiles/RDB-2.6d.tar.gz ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-stable/All/rdb-2.6d.tbz You may also be interested in NoSQL: http://www.scriptaworks.com/cgi-bin/wiki.cgi/NoSQL/HomePage and reldb: http://gatekeeper.dec.com/pub/usenet/comp.sources.unix/volume20/reldb/ Andru From dfevans at bbcr.uwaterloo.ca Thu May 10 22:49:02 2007 From: dfevans at bbcr.uwaterloo.ca (David Evans) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 08:49:02 -0400 Subject: [TUHS] [pups] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <20070510124902.GA26486@bcr10.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, May 10, 2007 at 11:42:55PM +1200, Wesley Parish wrote: > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a > hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the > Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) > Yes. There was a posting to, I think, alt.os.multics within the last few months describing it a bit. > Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a simulator/emulator? > And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? > I know that the above emulator was accessible on the net and was running Primos; I don't recall where it came from. -- David Evans dfevans at bbcr.uwaterloo.ca Research Associate http://bbcr.uwaterloo.ca/~dfevans/ Computer Laboratory, University of Cambridge From wes.parish at paradise.net.nz Fri May 11 19:43:58 2007 From: wes.parish at paradise.net.nz (Wesley Parish) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 21:43:58 +1200 Subject: [TUHS] Two matters, two questions In-Reply-To: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> References: <200705102342.56633.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Message-ID: <200705112143.59176.wes.parish@paradise.net.nz> Thanks everybody for your replies. I've downloaded the rdb and NoSQL and will have a look at them. Now I'm off to look at comp.sys.prime and alt.os.multics! Again, thanks Wesley Parish On Thursday 10 May 2007 23:42, Wesley Parish wrote: > I've just finished reading Peter Salus' "A Quarter Century of Unix", and > this time round, I was brought up short by the comments on Prime, Primos > and The Software Tools. > > Has anyone done a simulator/emulator of the Prime? (I must confess, a > hardware architecture that's described as a cross between a GE-645 and the > Intel 80286, not only intrigues me, it also makes my toes curl. ;) > > Has anyone attempted to get a copy of PrimOS for such a simulator/emulator? > And if one was to attempt such a feat, where would one go? > > And Spafford says, commenting on Prime's version of Software Tools, that > the final release was into the public domain. Is it still extant? Has > anyone seen hair or hide of the creature? > > That's the first matter/question. The second one is to do with /rdb, which > a quick search on Google informs me, was written by Walter V. Hobbs of Rand > Corp., and was placed in the public domain. It apparently is at: > ftp://ftp.rand.org/pub/RDB-hobbs > but I can't get through to it. > > Is there any copy of it extant at some site where I can get through to it? > (I'm aware there is a software publisher that sells a more up-to-date > version of it, but I'd like to play with the original and bring it up to > date myself ;) > > Thanks > > Wesley Parish -- Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish ----- Gaul is quartered into three halves. Things which are impossible are equal to each other. Guerrilla warfare means up to their monkey tricks. Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom of the foolish. ----- Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui? You ask, what is the most important thing? Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata. I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people. From new_zmkm at hotmail.com Sun May 20 21:57:58 2007 From: new_zmkm at hotmail.com (zmkm zmkm) Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 11:57:58 +0000 Subject: [TUHS] sys III docs Message-ID: Hi all just a quick question , any documentation or notes available online for unix sys III ? Like the v7 ones . Tks & rgs _________________________________________________________________ Like the way Microsoft Office Outlook works? You�ll love Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_outlook_0507 From eijiro_nagano at nifty.ne.jp Sun May 20 22:32:37 2007 From: eijiro_nagano at nifty.ne.jp (Eijiro Nagano) Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 21:32:37 +0900 Subject: [TUHS] sys III docs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000601c79ada$f3401640$020ba8c0@qosmio> Hi Here is unix sys III distribution archive. http://public.planetmirror.com/pub/ancient-unix/ancient/sysIII/sys3.tar.gz Untar this archive, sysIII docs (roff format) are in the following directory. /usr/src/man/docs Regards Eijiro -----Original Message----- From: tuhs-bounces at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:tuhs-bounces at minnie.tuhs.org] On Behalf Of zmkm zmkm Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 8:58 PM To: TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org Cc: pups at minnie.tuhs.org Subject: [TUHS] sys III docs Hi all just a quick question , any documentation or notes available online for unix sys III ? Like the v7 ones . Tks & rgs _________________________________________________________________ Like the way Microsoft Office Outlook works? Youll love Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migratio n_HM_mini_outlook_0507